The Question

You are not logged in.

Announcement

Due to the high number of false-bannings lately, I've taken down Akismet, and am opting to manually approve new members. If you're a new member and want to expedite the process of being upgraded in member status, shoot me an email at noface@vicsage.com. I'm hoping to find a better solution in the near future....

#1 2006-08-05 22:29:05

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Alright, shallow question. Which woman fits best with Vic? In many ways, the character's love life isn't very developed. But we've seen him with two women so far, to various degrees (much more intimate with say, Huntress, in the JLU-verse).

1. The Huntress - sparks flew because she understands the life that Vic as a crimefighter has. She's flawed and in need of redemption. She rivals him in physical prowess in many ways.

2. Myra Connelly Fermin - the ship has sailed, and we've seen she's loved post-Vic (because Sage dropped the ball!), but when they were together, it seemed like a soulmate connection.

3. Lady Shiva - needed more than just two entries, and Vic once commented he didn't know whether violence or make-out session was on Lady Shiva's mind. There was often a minor tension between the two, since they are both creatures of both poise and violence.

Other options vary. Veitch gave us a crush on Lois Lane (in that part, Sage reminded me of a lovestruck Rorschach - staring at Lane from afar), but Big Blue prevents that (there's an Elsewords for you - Superman leaves Earth for five years, and comes back to find Lane has married Vic Sage).

Oracle
's an option, even just for a short relationship, since the Bat-writers will probably always have her and Grayson flirting. Still, she's a strong, self-made personality who understands a love for information and ferreting out secrets. I could see Vic and Barb (who we know have done some sleuthing together) having some great philosophical conversations. She wouldn't need them as much as Helena did, but it'd be cute.

In my heart of hearts, Black Canary is always with Green Arrow. But not too long ago, Judd Winick soured that relationship. Might be an interesting dynamic between Black Canary and Q?. I always wanted to see the DCU Question and Black Canary team up without Ollie for a major, long-term case.

Imagine a majorly superpowered woman like Zatanna or Nightshade falling for Vic. I think it'd intimidate him, since she'd have an upper hand.

In Identity Crisis, Firehawk made a quip about a friend dating The Question, noting that he anticipated everything, including the break-up, and quoted Nietzsche too much. Who was that friend? Huntress?

So, what do you guys think? Who would you like to see with Vic, and I don't just mean in a quick carnal sense.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#2 2006-08-05 22:38:58

Eric
Site Administrator
From: Capital Region, NY
Registered: 2006-05-07
Posts: 1787
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I voted Huntress for pretty much the reasons you illustrate above. I enjoyed B/H: CFB a metric ton, especially their interactions. I liked the relationship on the JLU show as well.

Myra's definitely moved on. Shiva's not the dating kind (unless you're another cold-blooded murderer). Oracle has recently been proposed to by Nightwing, I think. Black Canary is the Green Arrow's woman, and you're not supposed to do that to your friends. If Vic dated Lois, he'd wake up with a perfectly formed laser hole through his forehead. Or I guess, he wouldn't wake up.

Plus, I like the relationship as Rucka presented it of the Huntress mirroring the actions and attitudes of a young Vic. And also, I hate to be base about it, but...well, I mean...look at her.

--Eric

Offline

 

#3 2006-08-05 22:43:17

Spider-Gamer
Member
From: Florida
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 52
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I voted Huntress for pretty much the reasons you illustrate above. I enjoyed B/H: CFB a metric ton, especially their interactions. I liked the relationship on the JLU show as well.

Myra's definitely moved on. Shiva's not the dating kind (unless you're another cold-blooded murderer). Oracle has recently been proposed to by Nightwing, I think. Black Canary is the Green Arrow's woman, and you're not supposed to do that to your friends. If Vic dated Lois, he'd wake up with a perfectly formed laser hole through his forehead. Or I guess, he wouldn't wake up.

Plus, I like the relationship as Rucka presented it of the Huntress mirroring the actions and attitudes of a young Vic. And also, I hate to be base about it, but...well, I mean...look at her.

--Eric

She sure is a looker!  wink


"What is character? Is it in your blood or can it be learned? Is it obvious or is it
impossible to define? Will you recognize it if you see it? Not if you have to ask."

Offline

 

#4 2006-08-05 23:23:52

Flash1087
The "Wizard"
From: Russia, with Love
Registered: 2006-08-05
Posts: 1621
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Ideally, it'd be Myra that he winds up with, I think. They had a very deep connection with each other, and in The Question Returns, Vic seemed deeply regretful that he botched that one.

In all likeliness, though, The Huntress is going to be a much longer-lasting romantic interest for him (although it'd be interesting to see him wind up with Lois...) and, really, he could do much worse.

Also, why didn't you suggest Renee Montoya? I mean, haven't you seen Chasing Amy?  wink


"RAND PROTECT US! THAT'S THE BEE'S KNEES!"-Mistah A

Offline

 

#5 2006-08-05 23:30:27

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Also, why didn't you suggest Renee Montoya? I mean, haven't you seen Chasing Amy?  wink

Ha! Kevin Smith will write the mini-series. It will take four years to finish. The Question will make many lewd comments to Batman, who will discover pot.

I almost put Renee on the list, but thought I'd get flack for it. I really think DC would get some hate mail if Renee had a heterosexual affair, but man, I'd love those two together.

Then again, it's kind of cute, the brother/sister relationship that's starting to evolve in 52.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#6 2006-08-06 10:06:46

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Huntress.

There characters are such good mirrors of each other. Their both exiles in a sense, they both have strong sense of right and wrong, they get along (for the most part). They both play each other very well..huh..WHY ISN'T HUNTRESS IN 52?!?!?!!!!


Who are you?

Offline

 

#7 2006-08-06 10:43:18

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

WHY ISN'T HUNTRESS IN 52?!?!?!!!!

You know, that's a really good question. They have good reasons (I guess) for inventing Batwoman, but why abandon a time-tested heroine?

With all the growth she's experienced in BoP, I'd love to see how Vic responds to her now.

As for creating new Bat-folk, I miss Cassandra Cain/Batgirl. Not that she's a candidate for Vic (he's too old for her), but for the past few years, my favorite comic book characters have been:

1. Vic Sage
2. Oliver Queen / Cassandra Cain (tie)
3. Bruce Wayne
4. Clark Kent
5. Lex Luthor


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#8 2006-08-06 13:24:10

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Cain was pretty cool. Probably my favorite Batgirl.

Regarding Huntress. I guess with the fact that Harvey Dent is in Gotham along with Batwoman there isn't much space for her.

But you never know! Maybe Huntress becomes Q?. Hurm. I don't think I'd enjoy that much.


Who are you?

Offline

 

#9 2006-08-06 15:56:39

Gabo
Little Eno
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2006-07-10
Posts: 442
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

What happened to Cassandra Cain? Did she die? Sorry, I haven't read Batman titles for a long time...

Offline

 

#10 2006-08-06 16:33:53

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

What happened to Cassandra Cain? Did she die? Sorry, I haven't read Batman titles for a long time...

This is all spoilers.

Near the end of her series, she went on a quest to find out if Lady Shiva was, as various writers had built up to over the years, her biological mother. She ended up finding Shiva along with the other daughter of the Demon's Head, Nyssa, in cahoots with Luthor's secret supervillain society. Mr. Freeze was there as well. Mr. Freeze's wife Nora was a bargaining chip - if Freeze made tech for the society, Nyssa would work on one of the infamous Lazarus pits so it could revive the frozen/nearly-dead Nora.

Freeze, sick of being a puppet, teamed up with Batgirl, freeing Cassandra and fighting their way to the pit. They put Nora in, but it wasn't the wisest move. It brought her back as Lazara, with pit-related powers both of fire manipulation and the ability to raise the dead. After fighting the risen dead of ethnically cleansed victims with Freeze (with a great exchange between Freeze and his wife, who might turn out to be a good character in the Bat-verse), Cassandra escaped with Freeze's help, absconding with some disillusioned students of Shiva's.

After fighting some of Shiva's faithful, including Mad Dog, who was also raised like Cassandra by David Cain, Batgirl took on Shiva, who wanted someone to prove they were able to kill her and set her free.

Cassandra broke Shiva's neck, but wasn't going to kill her. Shiva begged her, so Cassandra did so - by tossing Shiva onto a gruesome meathook. Shiva died, thanking Cassandra - but the hook was over the Lazarus Pit. Cassandra left, realizing from talks with Shiva and Nyssa that Batman's ways weren't hers (I completely disagree with this twist on the character).

One Year Later, she appeared in Robin as a straight-up villain, much more articulate than ever before, and very murderous. Time will tell if this was mind control or brainwashing, but it doesn't look likely. Shiva is of course alive and in the pages of BoP.

This could evolve into another thread. I'm pretty pissed about the core DCU writers deciding they didn't like Cassandra, but it's their decision and their right. Of course, that and the direction Green Arrow took are the reason 52 is the only book I'm buying regularly.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#11 2006-08-07 05:57:05

Gabo
Little Eno
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2006-07-10
Posts: 442
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Thanks for all the story... yeah, she was a good character and it would be a shame if she's just treated as a villain. I, for one, can't stand Shiva, so I would have preferred her to have died once and for all...

Offline

 

#12 2006-08-07 08:23:15

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I, for one, can't stand Shiva, so I would have preferred her to have died once and for all...

Here! Here! Then people can stop mentioning her in every other Batman issue (I swear it happens).


Who are you?

Offline

 

#13 2006-08-07 10:47:52

Eric
Site Administrator
From: Capital Region, NY
Registered: 2006-05-07
Posts: 1787
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I liked Shiva in Richard Dragon, and then in the Question, and in her early Batman appearances, especially in the first Robin mini-series.

But her uber-stature does get sort of annoying at times. I'm not sure that all writers know how to handle her.

--Eric

Offline

 

#14 2006-08-07 11:00:34

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

My experience with her is more one of annoyence. I feel like in some of my favorite recent Batman arcs characters would randomly start talking about Lady Shiva. I mean good for Batgirl that she beat Lady Shiva (the first time), but I didn't really care about that in Bruce Wayne: Fugative, I cared about WHO FRAMED BATMAN/BRUCE WAYNE! Lady Shiva herself is a interesting character but she really hasn't been used the right way for a while, which has led to my negative feelings about her character.


Who are you?

Offline

 

#15 2006-08-07 11:20:19

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Yeah, I was hoping her Lazarus Pit dip in Batgirl would impact how they've brought her back. She's still sneaking into the windows of heroes in their secret identities, still acting like a battle god. It's good to have that, but she's fulfilled that role for two decades. Time to do something new with the character.

Imagine her, post-Lazarus Pit, having some degree of amnesia. She's good, but not great. Yet having her on the Birds of Prey is symbolic, so Bruce sends her to Vic of all people to train, and Vic has to deal with "how much" to teach her, and the curiosity of what happens when she remembers fully who she was and what she was able to do.

But when it all comes flooding back, especially what she did with her daughter, the lives she took without a thought, don't turn her back into the female Batman who kills. Give her an actual change of heart.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#16 2006-08-07 14:32:35

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Sounds like a job for Continuity Pirate! I mean Psycho Pirate!


Who are you?

Offline

 

#17 2006-08-07 19:57:19

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Sounds like a job for Continuity Pirate!

You mean Geoff Johns?

OH SNAP


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#18 2006-08-07 20:02:57

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Shhh don't tell anyone that he's Psycho Pirate III! The Son of Power Girl and Psycho Pirate II...FROM THE FUTURE!


Who are you?

Offline

 

#19 2006-08-08 00:10:29

HAWkK
The Wallpaper Man
From: Bulgaria
Registered: 2006-07-19
Posts: 257

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I think The HUNTRESS will be perfects for him like a soulmate :?:

Offline

 

#20 2006-08-08 06:08:56

Gabo
Little Eno
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2006-07-10
Posts: 442
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Shhh don't tell anyone that he's Psycho Pirate III! The Son of Power Girl and Psycho Pirate II...FROM THE FUTURE!

lol  LOL!!!

As for Shiva, I never actually liked her, not even so much in Q? She got so annoying, like in #31 when she apparently dates the man who works for the demolition team... luckily good ol' Izzy voices my thoughts out loud:
Shiva: "We can learn from the rats. They always leave when it is time... and they do not dream."
Izzy: "Geez, now that is profound. 'Scuse me... I'm gonna find a bathroom and think about it."

GO IZZY!

Offline

 

#21 2006-08-08 09:02:23

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Shhh don't tell anyone that he's Psycho Pirate III! The Son of Power Girl and Psycho Pirate II...FROM THE FUTURE!

lol  LOL!!!

As for Shiva, I never actually liked her, not even so much in Q? She got so annoying, like in #31 when she apparently dates the man who from the demolition team... luckily good ol' Izzy voices my thoughts out loud:
Shiva: "We can learn from the rats. They always leave when it is time... and they do not dream."
Izzy: "Geez, now that is profound. 'Scuse me... I'm gonna find a bathroom and think about it."

GO IZZY!

Izzy obviously was the true philosopher in that relationship.


Who are you?

Offline

 

#22 2006-08-08 12:44:37

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

I think The HUNTRESS will be perfects for him like a soulmate :?:

Yeah, I really think in BoP, if Vic survives 52, it would make a great subplot for Huntress to have Q? be brought in as a temporary ally. In that, Oracle's got a great deal of information but no conclusions.

Bruce: Can't crack the False Face Society information?
Barb: No, you checking in to help? Or gloat?
Bruce: (smiling) Neither. But I think I might know someone who can answer...the question.
Barb: Ooh, Bruce, bad idea - I've got Huntress on this case.
Bruce: They'll be professional.

The Timm-verse has influenced the DCU before - with Harley Quinn, for one. The Q?/Huntress relationship was a surprise hit of JLU.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#23 2006-08-08 15:06:08

?
Conspiracy Theorist
From: New York
Registered: 2006-06-26
Posts: 1874
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies


The Timm-verse has influenced the DCU before - with Harley Quinn, for one. The Q?/Huntress relationship was a surprise hit of JLU.

Don't forget about Renee Montoya! She's 100% Timm...tastic?


Who are you?

Offline

 

#24 2006-08-08 21:30:18

Carter
takes a punch with style
From: a River City
Registered: 2008-02-24
Posts: 48
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies


The Timm-verse has influenced the DCU before - with Harley Quinn, for one. The Q?/Huntress relationship was a surprise hit of JLU.

Don't forget about Renee Montoya! She's 100% Timm...tastic?

As a kid, Renee and Bullock were one of my favorite parts of the original B:tAS. Their chemistry worked so well as partners. Bullock and Batman had a great exchange in the DCU a couple months ago, I hope his character returns to its place of value in the Bat-mythos.


"Art is about our fourth survival priority. And one can only assume that it therefore must have importance." - Alan Moore

Offline

 

#25 2006-09-02 22:47:55

Alba Aulbath
Member
From: In a ditch outside of Hub City
Registered: 2006-08-20
Posts: 53
Website

Re: Let's Get Vapid: Vic's Ladies

Not sure if I want Huntress/Q? again. Not to spite the pairing; I like their dynamics. But I'd rather see some experimental relationships around the DCU with Vic Sage and Q alike, see what works and doesn't work.

Offline

 

Board footer

Powered by PunBB
© Copyright 2002–2005 Rickard Andersson